kjblack wrote: ↑15 Nov 2023, 17:58
Just finished this - a great read from an interesting and charismatic man.
A key point in the final pages when JJ is discussing Toby, "...he plays the way Dave did twenty five years ago, respecting every note.Nowadays, The Stranglers is almost like classical music."
I think this is why Baz, Toby and Jim are accepted and Paul and Jon were not - the fans love the music and will attend to hear it in the same way fans of Mahler, Beethoven, Mozart attend to listen to different musicians playing the music.
The presence of JJ retains a vital link to the origin of the band but the music will outlive the creators.
Good points,but I really hope when JJ decides he has had enough,the band finish, I hope that will be the case.Major Kudu.
I agree but I have an awful feeling they might continue with JJ’s blessings if he hangs up his bass, which is fair enough I guess. If theres demand and people want to go to see ‘The Stranglers’ then good luck to them. It’s a business after all and both JJ & Hugh would benefit from their songs getting played whilst they’re sat at home with pipe & slippers.
I won’t be going to see em and will cherish The Stranglers gigs I attended especially between ‘82-‘90 but good luck as well to whoever gets that job on bass
kjblack wrote: ↑15 Nov 2023, 17:58
Just finished this - a great read from an interesting and charismatic man.
A key point in the final pages when JJ is discussing Toby, "...he plays the way Dave did twenty five years ago, respecting every note.Nowadays, The Stranglers is almost like classical music."
I think this is why Baz, Toby and Jim are accepted and Paul and Jon were not - the fans love the music and will attend to hear it in the same way fans of Mahler, Beethoven, Mozart attend to listen to different musicians playing the music.
The presence of JJ retains a vital link to the origin of the band but the music will outlive the creators.
Good points,but I really hope when JJ decides he has had enough,the band finish, I hope that will be the case.Major Kudu.
I'm with you on that but I suppose the the deciding factor will be if there is an audience for the 'brand.'
Just look at the number of tribute acts that are selling in sizeable venues these days.
kjblack wrote: ↑15 Nov 2023, 17:58
Just finished this - a great read from an interesting and charismatic man.
A key point in the final pages when JJ is discussing Toby, "...he plays the way Dave did twenty five years ago, respecting every note.Nowadays, The Stranglers is almost like classical music."
I think this is why Baz, Toby and Jim are accepted and Paul and Jon were not - the fans love the music and will attend to hear it in the same way fans of Mahler, Beethoven, Mozart attend to listen to different musicians playing the music.
The presence of JJ retains a vital link to the origin of the band but the music will outlive the creators.
The music will outlive the creators intresting...
It has been said in the past by Sil or was it Jet I can't remember who said that the entity is bigger than anyone member ..and I suppose that's true enough as I never gave them a year or two without Hugh but here we are 33 years on with now a second vocalist after Hugh.
But for me there comes a point and out of those 33 years without Hugh the majority of that time there still was three of the originals left that has gone to just one in recent times and JJ is still a huge member to have,original member,songwriter and bassist from the beginning and the whole 50 years of the creation of the band and I get that that for me though they are just about hanging in as the Stranglers by the skin of their teeth as the entity goes and for me once JJ goes there is no band left and ok the entity could carry on as a tribute band because that is what they will be but there comes a point that it's not the stranglers and i'm still backing them today and in their corner but when he goes if Baz and Co did carry on then that would be it for me...there's a limit and I honestly don't think for one minute Baz of the rest of them surely could think for a minute or tnT it would be rignt that they could without him well I'd like to think they wouldn't carry on.
Last edited by toilerinblack on 15 Nov 2023, 20:43, edited 6 times in total.
Id be incredibly surprised if their music is remembered and applauded in 100 years from now when it barely registers with Joe Public now. What's this obsession for it to continue forever? Just enjoy it now while you're alive and while it's semi relevant
Jim
Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk
"I bathed in sun and walked in rain
It taught me how to laugh again"
kjblack wrote: ↑15 Nov 2023, 17:58
Just finished this - a great read from an interesting and charismatic man.
A key point in the final pages when JJ is discussing Toby, "...he plays the way Dave did twenty five years ago, respecting every note.Nowadays, The Stranglers is almost like classical music."
I think this is why Baz, Toby and Jim are accepted and Paul and Jon were not - the fans love the music and will attend to hear it in the same way fans of Mahler, Beethoven, Mozart attend to listen to different musicians playing the music.
The presence of JJ retains a vital link to the origin of the band but the music will outlive the creators.
The music will outlive the creators intresting...
It has been said in the past by Sil or was it Jet I can't remember who it it was said that the entity is bigger than anyone member ..and I suppose that's true enough as I never gave them a year or two without Hugh but hear we are 33 years on with now a second second vocalist after Hugh.
But for me there comes a point and out of those 33 years without Hugh the majority of that time there still was three of the originals left that has gone to just one in recent times and JJ is still a huge member to have,original member,songwriter and bassist form the whole nearly 50 years now and I get that that they are hanging in with the skin of their teeth for me as the entity goes and for me once JJ goes there is no band left and ok the entity could carry on as a tribute band because that is what they will be,they comes a point and i'm still backing them today and in their corner but when he goes if Baz and Co did carry on then that would be it for me...there's a limit and I honestly don't think for one minute Baz of the rest cN think for a minute that they could without him well I'd like to think he wouldn't cry on.
JJ also says in the book that when Dave died he got a phone call from management and assumed the upcoming tour was going to be cancelled but in fact he was phoning to say that ticket sales were through the roof.
So, even though the audience knew that three out of four of the original band were not performing, demand had increased.
Next time you see the band and Baz is singing, close your eyes and say, honestly if you could tell who was playing bass and if it diminished your pleasure listening to the song.
(Having said all that, I was like you in thinking the band could not survive when Hugh left.)
kjblack wrote: ↑15 Nov 2023, 17:58
Just finished this - a great read from an interesting and charismatic man.
A key point in the final pages when JJ is discussing Toby, "...he plays the way Dave did twenty five years ago, respecting every note.Nowadays, The Stranglers is almost like classical music."
I think this is why Baz, Toby and Jim are accepted and Paul and Jon were not - the fans love the music and will attend to hear it in the same way fans of Mahler, Beethoven, Mozart attend to listen to different musicians playing the music.
The presence of JJ retains a vital link to the origin of the band but the music will outlive the creators.
The music will outlive the creators intresting...
It has been said in the past by Sil or was it Jet I can't remember who it it was said that the entity is bigger than anyone member ..and I suppose that's true enough as I never gave them a year or two without Hugh but hear we are 33 years on with now a second second vocalist after Hugh.
But for me there comes a point and out of those 33 years without Hugh the majority of that time there still was three of the originals left that has gone to just one in recent times and JJ is still a huge member to have,original member,songwriter and bassist form the whole nearly 50 years now and I get that that they are hanging in with the skin of their teeth for me as the entity goes and for me once JJ goes there is no band left and ok the entity could carry on as a tribute band because that is what they will be,they comes a point and i'm still backing them today and in their corner but when he goes if Baz and Co did carry on then that would be it for me...there's a limit and I honestly don't think for one minute Baz of the rest cN think for a minute that they could without him well I'd like to think he wouldn't cry on.
JJ also says in the book that when Dave died he got a phone call from management and assumed the upcoming tour was going to be cancelled but in fact he was phoning to say that ticket sales were through the roof.
So, even though the audience knew that three out of four of the original band were not performing, demand had increased.
Next time you see the band and Baz is singing, close your eyes and say, honestly if you could tell who was playing bass and if it diminished your pleasure listening to the song.
(Having said all that, I was like you in thinking the band could not survive when Hugh left.)
I honestly did think that after seeing them for years as Mk1 I thought that there is no way that they could carry on without him ....but I was wrong for another 33 years lol
I couldn't get my head round the Stranglers carrying on without Hugh I just couldn't except it for years lol but here I still am after coming back lol
Like I say only for me as just one Mk1 fan only that is it on the live front and I will only see Hugh nowday's but that's just me and I still love what they are doing still they gig a dam good gig but they are liked more today because like I have said before they are more like Mk1 where Baz has taken them back to basics and roots so to speak but under Paul and John it was to different and not the stranglers that was the mistake I feel.
Last edited by toilerinblack on 15 Nov 2023, 21:40, edited 2 times in total.
Its a funny thing about the general public they always want what they cant have. So it doesnt surprise me at all that the ticket sales went through the roof when Dave passed away. Death will and always has done, drawn attention
Noel Gallagher said after Oasis split that they sell more Albums now than they ever did when they were together. When Elvis died i think every one of his singles came back into the charts as did the Jam singles when they split up. There will be loads more of those examples as well.
ThinkTank wrote: ↑15 Nov 2023, 21:14
Its a funny thing about the general public they always want what they cant have. So it doesnt surprise me at all that the ticket sales went through the roof when Dave passed away. Death will and always has done, drawn attention
Noel Gallagher said after Oasis split that they sell more Albums now than they ever did when they were together. When Elvis died i think every one of his singles came back into the charts as did the Jam singles when they split up. There will be loads more of those examples as well.
Yes that's quite true I remember Elvis virtually owning the top twenty around his death it was quite amazing but then he was the exception,but yes your right and like Hugh once sung........Everybody Loves you when your dead.
But I was a bit like that with Prince when he died I only realised just how talented he was in every department he was a musical genuis full stop who played all the instruments himself on his albums and his songwriting ability was quite exceptional and it was only after his passing that i actually realised that and wished i had seen him live but never did and didn't take to much notice of him at the time through the eighties,now i'd jump at seeing him but it's all a bit to late and after the event so to speak now,so it's another case of what your saying.
Off thread the majority of the British public don't give a fuck about the Stranglers music,most people like middle of the road music,off thread again I see Madness are doing a tour soon and they are playing huge arenas,I do like Madness but what is It about their music that enables them to play such huge venues? There is no way the current Stranglers could fill these Arena's,just got me thinking,back on thread I really love the book.Major Kudu.
Madness are doing a tour soon and they are playing huge arenas
Just as the Stranglers, the boys from Madness had a very impressive row of hits in 1979 - mid eighties. The whole ska/ two tone thing was for many people really big and for many this will be a lovely trip down memory lane. And, whereas we are left with one strangler (of the classic line up I mean) they only 'lost' one member along the way. Cathal Smyth aka Chas Smash - second singer and trumpet. Also, they split for some years when they lost their mojo whereas the stranglers carried on (struggling at times).
--eric--
i was attracted by a night torchlight parade
and there i came
Madness are doing a tour soon and they are playing huge arenas
Just as the Stranglers, the boys from Madness had a very impressive row of hits in 1979 - mid eighties. The whole ska/ two tone thing was for many people really big and for many this will be a lovely trip down memory lane. And, whereas we are left with one strangler (of the classic line up I mean) they only 'lost' one member along the way. Cathal Smyth aka Chas Smash - second singer and trumpet. Also, they split for some years when they lost their mojo whereas the stranglers carried on (struggling at times).
Also Madness have an acceptable coolness about them. The whole nutty boys thing. In comparison the stranglers are very uncool. Incidentally, my parents and other family members are seeing Madness next month
Jim
Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk
"I bathed in sun and walked in rain
It taught me how to laugh again"
If I'm not mistaken didnt the Stranglers support Madness once, in the early 2000s ?
Perhaps they could do it again lol..
Re the music being bigger than the members, well I've seen Straighten Out play numerous times and without any original Stranglers members in attendance. And all the music and whole occasion was just great!
So if JJ retires then, if I'm still up for a night out, and healthy enough to go out to gigs, there's no reason why I wouldn't go and see another tribute band play Stranglers music..
I agree with above post though, once we're all old / gone that'll be it essentially.
It's possible somebody might discover and play the records we bought I guess, but anything more than that is extremely unlikely IMO..
