Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

[StanInBlack]

But Aural Sculpture doesn't sound dated because of it's recording quality - whereas early Beatles do.

Actually, that IS a reason why Aural Sculpture - or any recording - sounds of its time. It sounds like an album recorded and mixed in 1983/1984 using the technology of the time for an audience of the time.

[8088]

But Aural Sculpture doesn't sound dated because of it's recording quality - whereas early Beatles do.

Actually, that IS a reason why Aural Sculpture - or any recording - sounds of its time. It sounds like an album recorded and mixed in 1983/1984 using the technology of the time for an audience of the time.

What are the tell tale signs in the recording process that AS was recorded in 1984?

[StanInBlack]

What are the tell tale signs in the recording process that AS was recorded in 1984?

A combination of period trends at the mixing stage (the way the levels are balanced, the way the instruments are equalised and the reverbs/outboard effects used) and use of the period equipment of the time.

[8088]

What are the tell tale signs in the recording process that AS was recorded in 1984?

A combination of period trends at the mixing stage (the way the levels are balanced, the way the instruments are equalised and the reverbs used) and use of the period equipment of the time.

If by period equipment you mean the instrumentation, that included the brass section which is the singular aspect that dates it and is not part of the recording process.

The technical studio aspects you mentioned simply don't exist outside the ears of the clique of sound engineers and recording professionals - if anyone here has always thought AS is so obviously 80s because of the reverb/eq please step forward.

[StanInBlack]

The technical studio aspects you mentioned simply don't exist outside the ears of the clique of sound engineers and recording professionals - if anyone here has always thought AS is so obviously 80s because of the reverb/eq please step forward.

I don't think you have to be a sound engineer or recording professional to recognise any of this, actually. It's blatantly apparent from merely listening to music from different time periods. It's the reason why Tears For Fears' Songs from the Big Chair sounds like a record recorded in 1984/1985 and not like a record recorded and released in 1994/1995.

If Aural Sculpture had been recorded in 1999 as opposed to in 1983/1984 using the technical equipment of the time it would have sounded very different even if they'd retained the brass section (because brass sections existed prior to 1984, naturally, and continued to exist AFTER 1984) ...

[8088]

If Aural Sculpture had been recorded in 1999 as opposed to in 1983/1984 using the technical equipment of the time it would have sounded very different even if they'd retained the brass section (because brass sections existed prior to 1984, naturally, and continued to exist AFTER 1984) ...

It would've sounded different yes (because digital recording had matured) but again, I suspect only to a narrow sector of people aware of such differences.

[StanInBlack]

It would've sounded different yes (because digital recording had matured) but again, I suspect only to a narrow sector of people aware of such differences.

The primary instruments on Aural Sculpture are guitar, bass, drums and keyboards, with occasional brass and backing vocals for decoration. Bruce Springsten's Born to Run album - released in 1975 - also features guitar, bass, drums and keyboards, with occasional brass and backing vocals for decoration. So why does one sound like it was recorded in mid '70s and the other one sound like it was recorded a decade later? Because they were both recorded with the technology of their time for an audience of their time.

[8088]

It would've sounded different yes (because digital recording had matured) but again, I suspect only to a narrow sector of people aware of such differences.

The primary instruments on Aural Sculpture are guitar, bass, drums and keyboards, with occasional brass and backing vocals for decoration. Bruce Springsten's Born to Run album - released in 1975 - also features guitar, bass, drums and keyboards, with occasional brass and backing vocals for decoration. So why does one sound like it was recorded in mid '70s and the other one sound like it was recorded a decade later? Because they were both recorded with the technology of their time for an audience of their time.

Undeniably but neither sound dated because of the recording techniques employed whereas AS is dated by it's brass section because brass was an overused 80s pop affectation which was my original point about what defines 'dated.'

[StanInBlack]

Undeniably but neither sound dated because of the recording techniques employed whereas AS is dated by it's brass section because brass was an overused 80s pop affectation which was my original point about what defines 'dated.'

No, both albums literally sound of their time (and thus "dated") as a direct result of the period in which they were recorded, for reasons explained prior - and again, brass did not just exist in '80s music, it also existed in '60s music (and definitely prior), '70s music, '90s music, '00s music and undoubtedly '10s music and thereafter. There are plenty of reasons why Aural Sculpture sounds of its time, but the use of brass is way down the list.

[8088]

Undeniably but neither sound dated because of the recording techniques employed whereas AS is dated by it's brass section because brass was an overused 80s pop affectation which was my original point about what defines 'dated.'

No, both albums literally sound of their time (and thus "dated") as a direct result of the period in which they were recorded, for reasons explained prior - and again, brass did not just exist in '80s music, it also existed in '60s music (and definitely prior), '70s music, '90s music, '00s music and undoubtedly '10s music and thereafter. There are plenty of reasons why Aural Sculpture sounds of its time, but the use of brass is way down the list.

Yes, you've stated you think 'of it's time' and 'dated' are the same as I've stated I think they're different.

I'm aware of the omnipresence of brass in contemporary music but nevertheless "trendy brass" was an 80s thing.

We don't agree on both counts so we may as well let the thread get back on track again.

[theraven1979]

Just to throw a potential grenade into this. I think La Folie and MiB *don't* sound "dated" or even "of their time"

As you were.

Jim

[StanInBlack]

Just to throw a potential grenade into this. I think La Folie and MiB *don't* sound "dated" or even "of their time"

They're two of my favourite things The Stranglers have ever done, but yeah - I don't think either of them sound like records made in 2021, particularly La Folie. But again, that's fine - as I said earlier, the fact that it's redolent of the time in which it was created is part of the appeal for me. I do think that The Gospel was a remarkable production achievement for 1980/1981 though, particularly taking into consideration what was going on with the band at the time. It was right on the cutting edge at the time and very pristine, and the way that Jet tracked his drums resulting in that sort of airless sterility of the drum tracks gives the record the illusion of being a digital recording even though it clearly isn't. While it still sounds good, though, the production of The Gospel would be outmoded within three or four years as production trends moved on.