What do our European cousins think about it?

[theraven1979]

Regardless - we're all fucked

Jim

[Turkey Troter]

Even Pidge ... apparently!

[PaulinLondon]

Regardless - we're all fucked

Jim

Seconded.

[cassini]

I have spoken to quite a few EU colleagues ove the last week - they just cant believe how short-sighted and arrogant cameron and osborne were at the talks. And cameron's claim that the financial services sector in the UK would be damaged by the proposls for closer fiscal union and EU budgetary approval were way off the mark - the banking sector was generally supportive, although some of the detail ( eg a remodelled version of a tobin tax) irked them.

[theraven1979]

Which is basically another way of saying "we're all fucked"

Jim

I have spoken to quite a few EU colleagues ove the last week - they just cant believe how short-sighted and arrogant cameron and osborne were at the talks. And cameron's claim that the financial services sector in the UK would be damaged by the proposls for closer fiscal union and EU budgetary approval were way off the mark - the banking sector was generally supportive, although some of the detail ( eg a remodelled version of a tobin tax) irked them.

[Bobinblack]

Having seen what Cameron has done in the past few days concerning Europe, I was wondering what our European compatriots think about our government and what the UK is doing?

Personally I think Cameron may have had a point, but he completely fucked it up with no plan B - Deadly to the UK and potentially could wipe us off the European Circuit which will be disastrous for businesses across the UK

Good thread, I too would be interested to hear other points of view, especially from our European friendsinblack, and more especially if the response doesn't involved 'We're all fucked'

No pretence from me, I generally feel like sleeping when politics and financial matters are on the news etc, but this all is making me think it's getting proper serious now. At least it's showing a undeniable split between the coalition though, which is like watching a snotty version of Til Death Us Do Part

[theraven1979]

I've given this a bit more thought in light of Bob's in-depth analysis and the conclusion is that regardless of whether we're in the EU or not we're pretty fucked either way.

Jim

[Bobinblack]

We're like Paxman and Marr me and thee mate, clearly too knowledgeable about it all. WHERE is the Euro Zone anyway?

[unbroken69]

Cameron has implied that the French forced his has hand on this issue. Was the problem for Dave `boy´ Cameron really that the French had loaded the table with proposals he could not accept?

Here is the draft proposal that Cameron presented very late in the day with no consultation with his EU partners and which was rejected by the others.
http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/75193128

It seems to me that while our EU partners wish to re-impose sensible Keynesian economics to solve the problem, Cameron on the other hand wishes to protect the Milton Firedman model of economics which we have been following for 32 years, which has ultimately been responsible for the state we´re in.

Cameron asked for a protocol imposing decision-making by unanimity on a number of areas of regulation currently decided by majority voting. This amounted to a big winding-back of the clock for many EU leaders, setting a horrendous precedent that could unravel the single market. As they see it, common rules for the common market have been adopted (with few exceptions, such as tax) by the Eu´s Qualified Majority Voting system ever since the Single European Act was approved by Thatcher in 1986.

I think it wasn´t Cameron´s intention to have the UK locked out the door, it was his bad management of the situation that caused that. He tailored his demands to the interests of Tory ideology and not to those of the interests of the UK as a whole. The sad thing is that he had the opportunity to back down on some issues, which would most definitely meant that the UK stayed in the room. But for whatever reason Cameron refused, most likely in a bad poker player over playing his hand scenario.

What Cameron has done is basically made the UK irelevant to our EU partners, which makes a mockery of the we´re all in it together nonsense. It might win him a few votes from UKIP voters, but bad news for the rest of the UK.

[fuzzguitars]

Well coming from this corner of Europe soon to be free Scotland. Dave Cameron sounds like the biggest con man of all time. I mean he sounds soooooo reasonable until you look at the facts.......Tory riot police, mass unemployment and now isolation, cowering from sniggering, snivelling, interbred Tory bastards like John Redwood (give us a song in Welsh you cunt) The only saving grace is if Cameron is still PM by the natural end of Parliament he going to watch Scotland leave the UK a fitting end for a loser like him.

[unbroken69]

Well coming from this corner of Europe soon to be free Scotland. Dave Cameron sounds like the biggest con man of all time. I mean he sounds soooooo reasonable until you look at the facts.......Tory riot police, mass unemployment and now isolation, cowering from sniggering, snivelling, interbred Tory bastards like John Redwood (give us a song in Welsh you cunt) The only saving grace is if Cameron is still PM by the natural end of Parliament he going to watch Scotland leave the UK a fitting end for a loser like him.

I hear what you´re saying, but don´t forget he has a Scottish Liberal Democrat by the name of Danny Alexander, putting across his unacceptable policies at the treasury. Alexander sacrificed his principles and his party´s manifesto in an exchange for a bit of ministerial power. Do you really want his ilk running an independent Scotland?

[fuzzguitars]

Well coming from this corner of Europe soon to be free Scotland. Dave Cameron sounds like the biggest con man of all time. I mean he sounds soooooo reasonable until you look at the facts.......Tory riot police, mass unemployment and now isolation, cowering from sniggering, snivelling, interbred Tory bastards like John Redwood (give us a song in Welsh you cunt) The only saving grace is if Cameron is still PM by the natural end of Parliament he going to watch Scotland leave the UK a fitting end for a loser like him.

I hear what you´re saying, but don´t forget he has a Scottish Liberal Democrat by the name of Danny Alexander, putting across his unacceptable policies at the treasury. Alexander sacrificed his principles and his party´s manifesto in an exchange for a bit of ministerial power. Do you really want his ilk running an independent Scotland?

Check out what Alex Salmond said about Alexander he basically called him a one term politician. The Lib Dems are all but finished in Scotland we don't do Tory up here apart from the Farmers and they don't count. I have never voted SNP in my life but I have to protect my family from Cameron, Gideon, Danny Alexander and Nick Clegg.