Dark Matters - Initial Thoughts/Reviews

[jason]

I think WIR has some great tracks up to Joy de Vivre but the end of it is surely their poorest moment in their career. Dark Matters feels far more complete imo and sounds like a proper Stranglers album. It's not perfect though. I'm still not sure about No man's Land (good chorus though) and Breathe is a slightly disappointing closer for me at the moment. However the first four tracks are superb and so are Moon and Stallion.

[StanInBlack]

I think WIR has some great tracks up to Joy de Vivre but the end of it is surely their poorest moment in their career.

It'd be easier for me to say what the poorest moment in their career was if we were only taking into consideration the Hugh years, if only because they did very little during that time that was out-and-out awful. Off the top of my head, it's probably something like "Motorbike" or "Something" for JJ, and "Hit Man" for Hugh (although that's actually a good song spoiled by a bad recording and arrangement). When you factor all of the post-Hugh stuff into the mix it gets a lot difficult, because for every decent moment MKII+ did, there's about two or three tracks that are just eh. There's a lot more competition for the "worst" in that regard.

[Bear Cage]

I think WIR has some great tracks up to Joy de Vivre but the end of it is surely their poorest moment in their career.

It'd be easier for me to say what the poorest moment in their career was if we were only taking into consideration the Hugh years, if only because they did very little during that time that was out-and-out awful. Off the top of my head, it's probably something like "Motorbike" or "Something" for JJ, and "Hit Man" for Hugh (although that's actually a good song spoiled by a bad recording and arrangement). When you factor all of the post-Hugh stuff into the mix it gets a lot difficult, because for every decent moment MKII+ did, there's about two or three tracks that are just eh. There's a lot more competition for the "worst" in that regard.

However there was a clear decline in output from the Stranglers with Hugh, with increasing numbers of average and less great songs (as they stopped working as a band and increasingly wrote and recorded in isolation, as well as seeming to focus on pop and having hits, which also stopped happening except with covers). That variability continued post Hugh (peeking in my opinion on WIR). But with both Hugh and the Stranglers post his decision to quit, the better albums (e.g. S16, NC, DM) are overall better than the worst of those with Hugh. That doesn’t make those albums (Dreamtime and 10) poor, it just says others are better.

But getting back to the subject (Dark Matters). I’ve listened to it again this morning and am still not even close to tiring of any of it, I think they’ve ordered the songs really well giving a great flow to a cracking album.
It’s not up with the very best of the Stranglers, but not that far behind. To my ears it is equal or better than anything they’ve recorded across the epic years and since.
Let’s hope that Hugh can similarly step up to the mark for his next album and we have another great album from him. And that The Stranglers find a way to continue and produce more quality output going forwards (but take less than 9 years to pull it together).

[8088]

Let’s hope that Hugh can similarly step up to the mark for his next album and we have another great album from him. And that The Stranglers find a way to continue and produce more quality output going forwards (but take less than 9 years to pull it together).

I think Hugh still holds all the aces for songwriting but could do with changing his format and/or collaborating with a clued up "laptop producer."

I hope The Stranglers get the new keyboard player on board and he's able to make a considerable contribution!

[StanInBlack]

However there was a clear decline in output from the Stranglers with Hugh, with increasing numbers of average and less great songs (as they stopped working as a band and increasingly wrote and recorded in isolation, as well as seeming to focus on pop and having hits, which also stopped happening except with covers). That variability continued post Hugh (peeking in my opinion on WIR). But with both Hugh and the Stranglers post his decision to quit, the better albums (e.g. S16, NC, DM) are overall better than the worst of those with Hugh. That doesn’t make those albums (Dreamtime and 10) poor, it just says others are better.

I don't really agree with this as I consider Dreamtime to be up there with their very best albums, I think it's start-to-finish great (starting as it does with the obviously great "Always the Sun" and finishing with the Hugh-era's last true epic in "Too Precious") and there's not a single track on it that I'd want to skip or replace with any of the b-sides of the period. I agree that 10 could have been better, but that was due to a combination of a shit vibe amongst the band members, the fact they had to record the album twice (the second time with an unsuitable producer), and the songwriting members had both gone off the boil (Hugh would get it back on Wired and pretty much stay there, JJ wouldn't truly return to form until "In the End" but he'd continue to be hit and miss). Hugh using up all of his best ideas on Wolf (a vastly superior record to 10) didn't help either. If I found myself having to make a choice between listening to Dreamtime and a post-Hugh Stranglers record, I'd choose Dreamtime without any hesitation or doubt. If I found myself having to make a choice between listening to 10 and any post-Hugh Stranglers record, I'd probably listen to a Hugh solo album.

[Bear Cage]

…
I think Hugh still holds all the aces for songwriting but could do with changing his format and/or collaborating with a clued up "laptop producer."

I always thought Hugh’s best stuff was when he was working collaboratively (earlier Stranglers, Robert Williams, Sons of Shiva) but JCC blew that well out of the water. Nevertheless a writing partner to add an extra dimension and bounce ideas between might be good, someone who could encourage his more avant-garde and experimental talents and stretch him in different directions, maybe a couple of instrumentals too.

[Bear Cage]

However there was a clear decline in output from the Stranglers with Hugh, with increasing numbers of average and less great songs (as they stopped working as a band and increasingly wrote and recorded in isolation, as well as seeming to focus on pop and having hits, which also stopped happening except with covers). That variability continued post Hugh (peeking in my opinion on WIR). But with both Hugh and the Stranglers post his decision to quit, the better albums (e.g. S16, NC, DM) are overall better than the worst of those with Hugh. That doesn’t make those albums (Dreamtime and 10) poor, it just says others are better.

I don't really agree with this as I consider Dreamtime to be up there with their very best albums, I think it's start-to-finish great (starting as it does with the obviously great "Always the Sun" and finishing with the Hugh-era's last true epic in "Too Precious") and there's not a single track on it that I'd want to skip or replace with any of the b-sides of the period. I agree that 10 could have been better, but that was due to a combination of a shit vibe amongst the band members, the fact they had to record the album twice (the second time with an unsuitable producer), and the songwriting members had both gone off the boil (Hugh would get it back on Wired and pretty much stay there, JJ wouldn't truly return to form until "In the End" but he'd continue to be hit and miss). Hugh using up all of his best ideas on Wolf (a vastly superior record to 10) didn't help either. If I found myself having to make a choice between listening to Dreamtime and a post-Hugh Stranglers record, I'd choose Dreamtime without any hesitation or doubt. If I found myself having to make a choice between listening to 10 and any post-Hugh Stranglers record, I'd probably listen to a Hugh solo album.

Each to their own.
I thought Wolf was patchy at best, Hugh’s attempt at middle of the road adult orientated rock, more miss than hit; Wired is better, but not brilliant (I think JJ’s Un Jour Parfait is much better than either).
I still listen to The Stranglers regularly, the emi albums and last 4 (now 5) mainly, with Feline not that far behind. The other albums less often, similar to Hugh’s solo output. The only ones not played are CCW (although I quite enjoyed them live) and with JCC (awful).

[Homer]

Been listening to this album whilst decorating, so I've heard it a few times now, and have to say I really do like it. They've came up with some good songs that really grow on you. Still can't get away with "Down' but hey-ho ...
I was very critical of 'Giants' ... and still never listen to it, tho they played a song from it in Berlin in 2019 which i enjoyed (Fickle?). Some really good stuff and glad I persevered with it.

[Cells&Plasma]

Been listening to this album whilst decorating, so I've heard it a few times now, and have to say I really do like it. They've came up with some good songs that really grow on you. Still can't get away with "Down' but hey-ho ...
I was very critical of 'Giants' ... and still never listen to it, tho they played a song from it in Berlin in 2019 which i enjoyed (Fickle?). Some really good stuff and glad I persevered with it.

It was 15 Steps @ Huxley's in Berlin on 8th Dec 2019.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

[alaninblack]

Monster vs DM - No choice for me DM wins all the time. Though I actually enjoyed Monster and have listed to that more than I have Dreamtime or even 10, but that's not hard for me as those two albums I've only every really skipped through. I really liked Girl In Hollywood, mainly because of the bassline. I know that Stan and others like Dreamtime and Hugh's current output, but I think that is because they just like listening to Hugh crooning, where as I prefer Hugh busting his gut on something like Nosferatu (the track) on even dare I say Ghost Train (crap song) but good vocals.

I guess a lot of this is when and what got you hooked into The Stranglers in the first place, if Golden Brown, Strange Little Girl and Always the Sun rocked your boat, then you would probably like AS, Dreamtime and maybe 10 and a lot of Hugh's other output. IMHO of course : )

[StanInBlack]

I know that Stan and others like Dreamtime and Hugh's current output, but I think that is because they just like listening to Hugh crooning, where as I prefer Hugh busting his gut on something like Nosferatu (the track) on even dare I say Ghost Train (crap song) but good vocals.

Hugh's impassioned vocal delivery on "Ghost Train" is actually quite unique (for him), and that's not even him singing on Nosferatu's title track - that's RW.

I guess a lot of this is when and what got you hooked into The Stranglers in the first place, if Golden Brown, Strange Little Girl and Always the Sun rocked your boat, then you would probably like AS, Dreamtime and maybe 10 and a lot of Hugh's other output. IMHO of course : )

Definitely in your opinion, since I do like Dreamtime and Hugh's solo work but the album that truly got me into the band was No More Heroes.

[MiB81]

Just got an email from a mate, he kinda knows I'm a Stranglers fan but I've not
mentioned anything recently to him about the new album. He wrote,
" I will admit to illegally downloading the new Stranglers album a few minutes ago -
heard a track on 6 Music the other day, not bad at all. They don't need my money as
much as the reams of dreadful indie shite I buy on Bandcamp every month."

I'll give him a coupla days before asking for his review, like...