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[toilerinblack]

I really miss Hugh in the Stranglers too but now i have seen him solo live a couple of times i am really appreciating what he is doing even more so. What he is doing currently is a lot closer to where i am for music these days for live stuff and i am just amazed at what Hugh does with the arrangements he is with out doubt a massive talent and genius that he makes it look effortless. He's work is very addictive to listen to so i feel i am very happy now how its all turned out and i will really look forward to Brighton i really cant wait.

I do miss he's very clever put downs to the audience and mockery he was the master for sure all in good fun as well. My favourite would be how he always would openly say if one audience was better than another :) Or of course try and hi-light the divide in the current audience of there opinions .

Its a shame Hugh doesnt still do that at the gigs but i guess its a different make up now so not appropriate so we will have to just listen to An evening with instead and reminisce :)

Thanks for the posts it did make me smile and remind me of really good times of my own.

Yes I think it was up to '90 a very different Hugh than the one you will experiance as a solo artist.
The one I went to see as a teenager was the one who was part of a band I liked seeing so much,he and JJ made the band for me when I used to see them so much together up front live.
I would watch them both up front from one to the other all the time and of course the other two members as well along with hearing the whole overall band sound together,but for me it was always about Hugh on the whole that got me there attending the gigs,he was part of a very successful band playing bigger venues with audiences of 2000 plus.
Today it's a smaller production of a three piece playing old and new material in very small venues which I prefer nowday's but back in the day I prefered him I the band playing big venues.
I love his solo material so much that in a way i am glad he went solo because I wouldn't of heard of such great material like Guilty,BEF,Monster and now the ever brilliance of MOM had remained a Strangler,so for me its swings and roundabouts for me with his musical career that has followed a right path in the end looking back with all the musical changes and styles he's done from band member to solo artist.
Looking back now where I was gutted he left I now think it was all for the best for sure with Hugh the perfect frontman for 16 years of the Stranglers best and most successful years of the '70s and '80s to a further but more quieter 30 odd years as a more low key small time solo artist with the more up close and personal gig you get from him which I prefer nowday's too but prefered the big band venues at the time it did over 30 years ago so for me it's all gone perfect in career time order along with the music styles it toke along with it too.
He's today writing and playing the right sort of material for his more maturer vocals and nowday's I think he's probably all tucked up for the night at the same time that the old band were ready to take to the stage for a late night full of energetic music...lol

[ThinkTank]

I really miss Hugh in the Stranglers too but now i have seen him solo live a couple of times i am really appreciating what he is doing even more so. What he is doing currently is a lot closer to where i am for music these days for live stuff and i am just amazed at what Hugh does with the arrangements he is with out doubt a massive talent and genius that he makes it look effortless. He's work is very addictive to listen to so i feel i am very happy now how its all turned out and i will really look forward to Brighton i really cant wait.

I do miss he's very clever put downs to the audience and mockery he was the master for sure all in good fun as well. My favourite would be how he always would openly say if one audience was better than another :) Or of course try and hi-light the divide in the current audience of there opinions .

Its a shame Hugh doesnt still do that at the gigs but i guess its a different make up now so not appropriate so we will have to just listen to An evening with instead and reminisce :)

Thanks for the posts it did make me smile and remind me of really good times of my own.

Yes I think it was up to '90 a very different Hugh than the one you will experiance as a solo artist.
The one I went to see as a teenager was the one who was part of a band I liked seeing so much,he and JJ made the band for me when I used to see them so much together up front live.
I would watch them both up front from one to the other all the time and of course the other two members as well along with hearing the whole overall band sound together,but for me it was always about Hugh on the whole that got me there attending the gigs,he was part of a very successful band playing bigger venues with audiences of 2000 plus.
Today it's a smaller production of a three piece playing old and new material in very small venues which I prefer nowday's but back in the day I prefered him I the band playing big venues.
I love his solo material so much that in a way i am glad he went solo because I wouldn't of heard of such great material like Guilty,BEF,Monster and now the ever brilliance of MOM had remained a Strangler,so for me its swings and roundabouts for me with his musical career that has followed a right path in the end looking back with all the musical changes and styles he's done from band member to solo artist.
Looking back now where I was gutted he left I now think it was all for the best for sure with Hugh the perfect frontman for 16 years of the Stranglers best and most successful years of the '70s and '80s to a further but more quieter 30 odd years as a more low key small time solo artist with the more up close and personal gig you get from him which I prefer nowday's too but prefered the big band venues at the time it did over 30 years ago so for me it's all gone perfect in career time order along with the music styles it toke along with it too.
He's today writing and playing the right sort of material for his more maturer vocals and nowday's I think he's probably all tucked up for the night at the same time that the old band were ready to take to the stage for a late night full of energetic music...lol

Yep i totally agree with you about Hugh. For me Hugh was the main man of the band and unreplaceable. I think if it was Jet or Dave that left the band i probably reluctantly could have gone on supporting the band going forward live and record. I think i could have done the same as well if it was JJ that had left. What i do know is that if any of the other 3 had left instead of Hugh i know Hugh would not have continued with the band only because i think he would have seen it as an opportunity to take his career solo but probably would have made an announcement that the other 3 could never be replaced.

Funny enough i did go to see the band after Hugh and it was with Paul at Brixton before their first Album i think it was their first appearance with Paul publicly in the UK it wasn't one of the secret gigs. I remember being very excited to see what they were like and my whole world just fell apart when Paul came out and was jumping about like a small child would along with all he's other weird actions also making weird noises and pulling faces it was just so surreal it was the biggest what the fuck moment that had ever hit me. I remember walking backwards when they came on thinking Noooo and ended up at the back of the hall lol. Its such a shame as he's got a great voice he didn't need to do all that bull shit especially the weird accents he put on to each word at the end of each sung line.

I really hope Paul does well though he comes across as a really good bloke but i don't think he was right for a band like the Stranglers and was totally stitched up he had no chance. I know he's very popular amongst the fans in this forum but a hell of a lot of fans left because of him i reckon about 70-80%.
Will you go and see Paul live do you think ? I didn't unfortunately see very much in his new single that he's got out he will need to come out with better than that if he's going to make it on his own i think maybe i need to give it a few more listens.

Lol at Hugh and early nights i remember JJ saying how Hugh would never be able to keep up if he was in the band now.

[Ruby]

Funny enough i did go to see the band after Hugh and it was with Paul at Brixton before their first Album i think it was their first appearance with Paul publicly in the UK it wasn't one of the secret gigs. I remember being very excited to see what they were like and my whole world just fell apart when Paul came out and was jumping about like a small child would along with all his other weird actions and pulling faces.It was just so surreal it was the biggest what the fuck moment that had ever hit me. I remember walking backwards when they came on thinking Noooo and ended up at the back of the hall lol. Its such a shame as he's got a great voice he didn't need to do all that bull shit especially the weird accents he put on to each word at the end of each sung line.
. I know he's very popular amongst the fans in this forum but a hell of a lot of fans left because of him i reckon about 70-80%.
Will you go and see Paul ?

My thoughts too.Nothing personal against the man.Maybe 80% of the fans stopped following because Hugh had left ? I would agree though that a substantial amount of those who remained decided to stop going after their first sighting of MKII. For all of his support on here I don't think many actually go and see Paul.

[ThinkTank]

Yeah totally it was a shock to see that line up for the very first time and it put me off totally. I have never bought an album or seen them live again. Well actually i saw them again somewhere like reading at a festival and i didn't know they were going to be there they just came on stage and started playing but i always forget about that as i didn't watch or listen i was just chatting to friends and wasn't interested.

The way i see it you cant force stage presence and the best presence on stage is the natural one and Hugh didn't have to try he just commanded that Lead singer role by just being himself and he had the audience in awe of him.

I feel what you see Paul doing is copying all he's heroes all in one . There is an overall look and behaviour of Michael Hutchence of Inxs and then also moulded in is Iggy pop / Julien cope / David Bowie and even Elvis Presley when he flicks he's hair and snaps he's fingers only he over eggs it so much more.
The best singers with the best stage presence just be themselves and it works so much better. When you watch Michael Hutchence and whether you like him or not it sort of looks right because it suits his style of music i cant say the same for Paul though and i am not a fan of Inxs at all.

[aldinblack]

Yeah totally it was a shock to see that line up for the very first time and it put me off totally. I have never bought an album or seen them live again. Well actually i saw them again somewhere like reading at a festival and i didn't know they were going to be there they just came on stage and started playing but i always forget about that as i didn't watch or listen i was just chatting to friends and wasn't interested.

The way i see it you cant force stage presence and the best presence on stage is the natural one and Hugh didn't have to try he just commanded that Lead singer role by just being himself and he had the audience in awe of him.

I feel what you see Paul doing is copying all he's heroes all in one . There is an overall look and behaviour of Michael Hutchence of Inxs and then also moulded in is Iggy pop / Julien cope / David Bowie and even Elvis Presley when he flicks he's hair and snaps he's fingers only he over eggs it so much more.
The best singers with the best stage presence just be themselves and it works so much better. When you watch Michael Hutchence and whether you like him or not it sort of looks right because it suits his style of music i cant say the same for Paul though and i am not a fan of Inxs at all.

I agree with your PR assessment.
Good singer (depending on your taste of course), and no doubt a talented songwriter.
But his on stage persona was ridiculous and, yes, just off-putting.
He could've done great, if he'd just sung the songs. But he was undone by his own ponciness :-)
Some criticize Baz for trying too hard at times, and yes I get it. But it's nothing compared to what PR was coming out with..
Good luck to him though.I would go and see him out of curiosity, and hopefully now he's a bit older he's toned it down a bit.

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[Ruby]

I had a seven year gap after Hugh.Lost interest the same as many did.Somebody borrowed me a recording of Maine Road,Manchester and it sounded alright,nothing special.I should have left it at that but they came to a town close by on the 1997 mini tour and I went along.Although the show was powerful,loud and played at a frenetic pace, the frontman spoiled it for me.Just way over the top.

[parasiteinblack]

Conversely, I was not really Paul fan when I originally heard the MKII albums but then when I saw the band live for the first time in 2002 I was converted.
In The Night grew on me especially, and then the others in the following years, particularly About Time and the first half of WIR.
By the time Norfolk Coast came out the Stranglers were at a peak for me, (in my lifetime anyway, as I was only in nursery school around the time Hugh left).
I saw Paul at the 100 Club in 2007 (with John on guitar too) and it was great, would recommend seeing him if you get the chance.

[toilerinblack]

I think Paul's a great singer/songwriter and a really nice guy but tbh he was or maybe any other frontman on an impossible mission following Hugh who for 16 years of this band was the Stranglers heart and soul of who they were.
For me I just think he was just everything opposite to what Hugh had set in stone as the successful Stranglers distinctive sound that the fans enjoyed and liked who built up this bands following with the sound and image of what this band was all about and had done for so long too, so for me only maybe it was to much of a change in vocal sound,looks,deliverence and presence,for me it was just to uch of a drastic change of both sound and image and especially ljve for me for a long time but did return in eventual time.
Saying that the first album minus Hugh did have some great tracks to it's name and sung very well by Paul too and in his more latter years with the band he grew into the role with songs that did work as a Strangler as NC showed.
I think once JE had left and in came Baz it started to work and for the better for Paul too in only my view but others may disagree with that analysis.
I think once both JE & PR had left the band Baz got JJ back of old and out out the lost Wilderness and way of how this band once and put them back on the right path again in my opinion only.
I think Paul has a great CV to his name for having been with the Stranglers it wasn't a mistake on his behalf would he have had the constant world wide travelling success and recordings to his name had he not been a Strangler for all those years and in some other band instead? I think not.
I think after Hugh they immediately went in such a different musical directional change with vocals,image and sound it was a massive change some may say too much of what was once was and maybe a name change ould of been an easier option but the brand name is their living and for me at that point in time in '90 I did want them them to change the name but that's a long time ago and nowday's on reflection it will be so good seeing them reach that majical 50 years next year and they are still a great tight live act.....so it's swings and roundabouts for me only really.
Overall though I do feel for Paul and Baz because it's an impossible position to be in following Hugh's set in stone footsteps and Paul is a great great vocalist one of the bands best but best is not always necessarily right for a particular styled and distinctive sounding band overall.
I think the band today are so standing on their own different feet and merit music wise as DM has shown to be a million miles away from what the band was producing with Hugh in it for sure that fans will either like or not like what they are doing ...I like what they are doing still today but again it's only my one fans view and take on it all...everyone will think differently.

[ThinkTank]

Yeah totally it was a shock to see that line up for the very first time and it put me off totally. I have never bought an album or seen them live again. Well actually i saw them again somewhere like reading at a festival and i didn't know they were going to be there they just came on stage and started playing but i always forget about that as i didn't watch or listen i was just chatting to friends and wasn't interested.

The way i see it you cant force stage presence and the best presence on stage is the natural one and Hugh didn't have to try he just commanded that Lead singer role by just being himself and he had the audience in awe of him.

I feel what you see Paul doing is copying all he's heroes all in one . There is an overall look and behaviour of Michael Hutchence of Inxs and then also moulded in is Iggy pop / Julien cope / David Bowie and even Elvis Presley when he flicks he's hair and snaps he's fingers only he over eggs it so much more.
The best singers with the best stage presence just be themselves and it works so much better. When you watch Michael Hutchence and whether you like him or not it sort of looks right because it suits his style of music i cant say the same for Paul though and i am not a fan of Inxs at all.

I agree with your PR assessment.
Good singer (depending on your taste of course), and no doubt a talented songwriter.
But his on stage persona was ridiculous and, yes, just off-putting.
He could've done great, if he'd just sung the songs. But he was undone by his own ponciness :-)
Some criticize Baz for trying too hard at times, and yes I get it. But it's nothing compared to what PR was coming out with..
Good luck to him though.I would go and see him out of curiosity, and hopefully now he's a bit older he's toned it down a bit.

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I don't understand why JJ never said anything to Paul he must have found his actions irritating as well surely . I do somehow think JJ has bad judgement and was always kept on the right path with Hugh's influence as JJ respected him. But i do wonder if JJ encouraged it as i remember JJ being asked about what it is like having Paul in the band from the media and he replied something like "I feel like an old dog with a puppies tail" so that sort of suggested that he liked the energetic approach.

lol @ ponciness that word is very apt for his stage performance

[ThinkTank]

I had a seven year gap after Hugh.Lost interest the same as many did.Somebody borrowed me a recording of Maine Road,Manchester and it sounded alright,nothing special.I should have left it at that but they came to a town close by on the 1997 mini tour and I went along.Although the show was powerful,loud and played at a frenetic pace, the frontman spoiled it for me.Just way over the top.

Thats interesting so how did you're interest stay with the Stranglers after having to deal with that lol. My interest never left but only the time period that Hugh was in the band and i just don't recognise anything other than that even today. I have always loved that time of the first 10 albums with Hugh and they still resonate with me to this day

You know what was really weird the gig i was at and i don't know if it was just where i was standing at the beginning but there was loads of Chinese fans in there and i have a good idea what your typical Stranglers fan were like back then and i had never seen any people like that in the gigs before. I thought it was very odd and never understood why even to this day.

I have listened to Dark Matters since being at this forum and its not really my sort of thing but at least i did listen to the whole album which is something i guess, i don't think there was any Paul albums that i could listen to more than 2 or 3 tracks in before being too bored to listen anymore. The best album with Paul is "In the Night" that's not a bad album but all the ones after that were just awful.

[ThinkTank]

Conversely, I was not really Paul fan when I originally heard the MKII albums but then when I saw the band live for the first time in 2002 I was converted.
In The Night grew on me especially, and then the others in the following years, particularly About Time and the first half of WIR.
By the time Norfolk Coast came out the Stranglers were at a peak for me, (in my lifetime anyway, as I was only in nursery school around the time Hugh left).
I saw Paul at the 100 Club in 2007 (with John on guitar too) and it was great, would recommend seeing him if you get the chance.

Oh the 100 club i loved it in there i used to use that as one of my old haunts back in the 80s regurlay . Mid week in the evenings the 100 club used to have Jazz and blues evening and have live bands playing and i loved the atmosphere. Once i was up at the bar getting the drinks in and i got talking to some guy who ended up being Georgie Fame who literally went up on stage to perform straight after chatting to me lol i didn't recognise him. I only went to the 100 club because of its history but its a great place to see bands when i used to go it was Ronnie Scots evenings and great memories.

[ThinkTank]

I think Paul's a great singer/songwriter and a really nice guy but tbh he was or maybe any other frontman on an impossible mission following Hugh who for 16 years of this band was the Stranglers heart and soul of who they were.
For me I just think he was just everything opposite to what Hugh had set in stone as the successful Stranglers distinctive sound that the fans enjoyed and liked who built up this bands following with the sound and image of what this band was all about and had done for so long too, so for me only maybe it was to much of a change in vocal sound,looks,deliverence and presence,for me it was just to uch of a drastic change of both sound and image and especially ljve for me for a long time but did return in eventual time.
Saying that the first album minus Hugh did have some great tracks to it's name and sung very well by Paul too and in his more latter years with the band he grew into the role with songs that did work as a Strangler as NC showed.
I think once JE had left and in came Baz it started to work and for the better for Paul too in only my view but others may disagree with that analysis.
I think once both JE & PR had left the band Baz got JJ back of old and out out the lost Wilderness and way of how this band once and put them back on the right path again in my opinion only.
I think Paul has a great CV to his name for having been with the Stranglers it wasn't a mistake on his behalf would he have had the constant world wide travelling success and recordings to his name had he not been a Strangler for all those years and in some other band instead? I think not.
I think after Hugh they immediately went in such a different musical directional change with vocals,image and sound it was a massive change some may say too much of what was once was and maybe a name change ould of been an easier option but the brand name is their living and for me at that point in time in '90 I did want them them to change the name but that's a long time ago and nowday's on reflection it will be so good seeing them reach that majical 50 years next year and they are still a great tight live act.....so it's swings and roundabouts for me only really.
Overall though I do feel for Paul and Baz because it's an impossible position to be in following Hugh's set in stone footsteps and Paul is a great great vocalist one of the bands best but best is not always necessarily right for a particular styled and distinctive sounding band overall.
I think the band today are so standing on their own different feet and merit music wise as DM has shown to be a million miles away from what the band was producing with Hugh in it for sure that fans will either like or not like what they are doing ...I like what they are doing still today but again it's only my one fans view and take on it all...everyone will think differently.

I think you're optimism is just great i don't think i have ever seen you say a bad word against anyone or anything that the band have done you always look for a good in all. Its a really good way to be actually i try to learn off your outlook in life ha ha but we are all different.

My view lol - unfortunately there is nothing wrong with being so different to the original band if you can still write big classics like the original 4 did. So i don't see Paul or Baz having a very good CV at all as it only hi-lights that they both have just lived off the merits of Hugh Cornwell. A new name a new band was the way to go if you cant compete then do things your own way as another entity.

DM was a success sort of but it will be the next album that will be the most telling if they do write a next one that is. I hate to say this but the upsetting and sad death of Dave before the release of the album brought the band a lot of attention from the media and fans which in turn brought an improved sales figure for the album. There is a phenomenon of how death within the media business that brings short term success for some reason that even the strangers mark 1 wrote about on that La Folie album with "Everybody Loves you when you are dead". Every Dark Matters album review / interview understandably dominated about Dave and the tribute song that JJ wrote for Dave on the album. Not to say its a bad album as it has some moments and probably the better album off their catalogue from what i have heard of it but i don't listen to much so i am no expert of there material. The next album will be the most telling though and they really should be capitalising on the success of DM and look at releasing the next one as soon as they can but my prediction will be a bit of a non event when its released.

Sorry its an awful thing to have to say but its just a very sad reality but Judgement of songs should not be by chart success anyway but i will be looking for a song like the classics that they wrote with the original 4 but i wont be holding my breath.