Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

JJ Burnel, ...., Baz Warne, Jim Macaulay.

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Jake
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Jon the Impaler wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 19:35
I liked Fire & Water , superb album . Would have to listen UJP as I have forgotten it now , sure it would be pretty good though . I listened to DM this week for the first time since at least Xmas , it's good imo though Down definitely not to my taste ( bleedin acoustic guitar) . I did say that though there are 6 songs I like , non would make my all time favourite list , but then those songs on that list are superb and it would also include stuff post Hugh, though I guess like the live set 75% plus of the best are M1 lineup.
Must give UJP a listen . Never heard Wolf so can't comment .

I somehow think Wolf won’t be to your taste

I wish the French version of “Down” was more easily available, something like that is to my taste.
What I seem to pick up is punters who prefer the stranglers 77-79, like more recent material because it has a harder edge. I can’t help feeling it’s actually quite tame and sounds a bit forced, inorganic even. I’ve nothing against the stranglers sounding more hard, but it’s not natural raw aggression like Rattus was for example. I dunno, I’m not saying they’re faking it, but it just doesn’t work me up that much, Baz’s voice is a lot to do with it, and the sound is more managed, lyrics are also not that good really. I think it’s too straight rock, where as the original stranglers were never just straight forward Rock, there’s not much uniqueness to DM in my opinion.
StanInBlack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 20:18 I wouldn't say Un Jour Parfait was better than Wolf, but I still rank it far higher than Dark Matters or pretty much everything released by the Stranglers' brand post-90.
I somehow thought you might say that 8)
I don’t mind Wolf, there are mostly good tracks on it, and it beats 10 for sure
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Jake wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:18 I somehow thought you might say that 8)
I don’t mind Wolf, there are mostly good tracks on it, and it beats 10 for sure
Yeah, I agree that song-for-song it's a stronger record than 10. I also agree that it's the least Jon the Impaler-y Stranglers-related record that I can think of :lol:
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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StanInBlack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:20
Yeah, I agree that song-for-song it's a stronger record than 10. I also agree that it's the least Jon the Impaler-y Stranglers-related record that I can think of :lol:
Can’t see him being impressed at al no 8)
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Jake wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:18 What I seem to pick up is punters who prefer the stranglers 77-79, like more recent material because it has a harder edge. I can’t help feeling it’s actually quite tame and sounds a bit forced, inorganic even. I’ve nothing against the stranglers sounding more hard, but it’s not natural raw aggression like Rattus was for example. I dunno, I’m not saying they’re faking it, but it just doesn’t work me up that much,
Jake, that is a very good way of putting it. I definately prefer my Stranglers with a hader edge. But I also think that Suite XVI sounded forced, I mentiond this before, to me it sounded like The Stranglers trying to sound like The Stranglers - and I know that sentance does not make any sense :shock:
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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StanInBlack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:20
Jake wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:18 I somehow thought you might say that 8)
I don’t mind Wolf, there are mostly good tracks on it, and it beats 10 for sure
Yeah, I agree that song-for-song it's a stronger record than 10. I also agree that it's the least Jon the Impaler-y Stranglers-related record that I can think of :lol:
Wolf is a great album agreed and i have always enjoyed it but for me i can't say too that it's better than a Stranglers mk1 album and song by song for me it is not stronger than 10 which most will disagree there but again it's just my opinion,even though i've always had a soft spot for Never Never what a blinding track and funny enough i played that track the other day in the car and thought it still sounds just so good.
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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alaninblack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 23:57

Jake, that is a very good way of putting it. I definately prefer my Stranglers with a hader edge. But I also think that Suite XVI sounded forced, I mentiond this before, to me it sounded like The Stranglers trying to sound like The Stranglers - and I know that sentance does not make any sense :shock:
Makes actually perfect sense. I liked Suite XVI a lot on release, but I know what you mean. I find Baz’s vocal forced on everything he does, I’m trying to be objective but I never felt him to be much in the way of lead singer material even on Non Hugh Cornwell numbers. I’d say Suite XVI is better songwriting on the whole than is the case with the next two albums. Musically Suite XVI is good, recording sounds a little too tinny/compressed for my liking, but definitely my favourite of the 3 albums released since Paul Roberts was sacked.
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Jake wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:18
Jon the Impaler wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 19:35
I liked Fire & Water , superb album . Would have to listen UJP as I have forgotten it now , sure it would be pretty good though . I listened to DM this week for the first time since at least Xmas , it's good imo though Down definitely not to my taste ( bleedin acoustic guitar) . I did say that though there are 6 songs I like , non would make my all time favourite list , but then those songs on that list are superb and it would also include stuff post Hugh, though I guess like the live set 75% plus of the best are M1 lineup.
Must give UJP a listen . Never heard Wolf so can't comment .

I somehow think Wolf won’t be to your taste

I wish the French version of “Down” was more easily available, something like that is to my taste.
What I seem to pick up is punters who prefer the stranglers 77-79, like more recent material because it has a harder edge. I can’t help feeling it’s actually quite tame and sounds a bit forced, inorganic even. I’ve nothing against the stranglers sounding more hard, but it’s not natural raw aggression like Rattus was for example. I dunno, I’m not saying they’re faking it, but it just doesn’t work me up that much, Baz’s voice is a lot to do with it, and the sound is more managed, lyrics are also not that good really. I think it’s too straight rock, where as the original stranglers were never just straight forward Rock, there’s not much uniqueness to DM in my opinion.
StanInBlack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 20:18 I wouldn't say Un Jour Parfait was better than Wolf, but I still rank it far higher than Dark Matters or pretty much everything released by the Stranglers' brand post-90.
I somehow thought you might say that 8)
I don’t mind Wolf, there are mostly good tracks on it, and it beats 10 for sure
Fair enough ( Wolf ) . Must say on listening to Un Jour last night , I much prefer Fire & Water , plus I think I would rate DM over it too . Its ok , of course but I just prefer those others ...each to their own though, at the end of the day what pleases each is all that matters . Its only opinion .
All quiet ..........
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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alaninblack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 23:57
Jake wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 22:18 What I seem to pick up is punters who prefer the stranglers 77-79, like more recent material because it has a harder edge. I can’t help feeling it’s actually quite tame and sounds a bit forced, inorganic even. I’ve nothing against the stranglers sounding more hard, but it’s not natural raw aggression like Rattus was for example. I dunno, I’m not saying they’re faking it, but it just doesn’t work me up that much,
Jake, that is a very good way of putting it. I definately prefer my Stranglers with a hader edge. But I also think that Suite XVI sounded forced, I mentiond this before, to me it sounded like The Stranglers trying to sound like The Stranglers - and I know that sentance does not make any sense :shock:
No , makes perfect sense to me ........ probably meaning the new version trying too hard to be an early Hugh era version .....but maybe thats why I love it and Norfolk ( except the jazz rubbish ) . I do like the harder edged stuff also but thats probably just the punk side of me , its also why I preferred a lot of M2 stuff over 10 by a country mile .
All quiet ..........
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Jake wrote:
alaninblack wrote: 26 Jan 2022, 23:57

Jake, that is a very good way of putting it. I definately prefer my Stranglers with a hader edge. But I also think that Suite XVI sounded forced, I mentiond this before, to me it sounded like The Stranglers trying to sound like The Stranglers - and I know that sentance does not make any sense :shock:
Makes actually perfect sense. I liked Suite XVI a lot on release, but I know what you mean. I find Baz’s vocal forced on everything he does, I’m trying to be objective but I never felt him to be much in the way of lead singer material even on Non Hugh Cornwell numbers. I’d say Suite XVI is better songwriting on the whole than is the case with the next two albums. Musically Suite XVI is good, recording sounds a little too tinny/compressed for my liking, but definitely my favourite of the 3 albums released since Paul Roberts was sacked.
Just to say that I find Suite to be the best "Baz vocal album" of the 3.
If anything his vocals have become more "forced" on let's say, This Song, than they ever were before.
I think, given the vocal range he has, he sings very well on songs like Spectre, Slipping, Bless You and Relentless.
I like DM and even a lot of Giants but Suite remains the best of those albums for me too.
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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aldinblack wrote: 27 Jan 2022, 11:57 I like DM and even a lot of Giants but Suite remains the best of those albums for me too.
I’d have to agree there
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Jon the Impaler wrote: 27 Jan 2022, 09:24
Fair enough ( Wolf ) . Must say on listening to Un Jour last night , I much prefer Fire & Water , plus I think I would rate DM over it too . Its ok , of course but I just prefer those others ...each to their own though, at the end of the day what pleases each is all that matters . Its only opinion .
Fire and Water is one of the best solo stranglers recordings imho..

I can’t see you digging Wolf because a lot of it sounds like an 80s pop record, but I dare you to have a listen 8)
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Re: Dark Matters - Second Thoughts

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Well for what it's worth im still enjoying Dark Matters with Mr Warnes forced vocals to, maybe he feels the force and all the slagging he gets on this forum probably makes him even more forced? I doubt he cares. Lt Kudu. :smt013
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